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tougefox
Administrator
USA
834 Posts |
 Posted - 07/19/2006 : 21:44:57
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i wanna see some pics of that fox of yours
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The Touge: Where drivers are found, not wanted...
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overkill
Moderator
USA
35 Posts |
Posted - 07/20/2006 : 02:46:21
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I'm going to be doing some suspension/exhaust work here early next week so i'll take some picks then and post them up.
And don't buy anything for your fox from Shine, I allmost got screwed by them. They won't return my e-mails or calls and I'm going to end up going with an o-bar rear sway instead (returned my email within 2 hours about pricing and availabity). So I will post up pics of that install too.
I took a que from you and acctually created the custom intake i've been wanting to do for the past 5 years.
I'm going to mount the metal piece in the front air dam.
And here is the exhaust in 2 pieces right now.
The flowmaster muffler is acctually from my BMW, still in great condition and should work just fine.
EDIT: and this experiment http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/VW-Jetta-Rabbit-Fox-CHROME-Audi-Style-4-Drs-Handles-NEW_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQcategoryZ33642QQihZ018QQitemZ280007854689QQrdZ1 |
Edited by - overkill on 07/20/2006 02:56:01 |
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tougefox
Administrator
USA
834 Posts |
Posted - 07/20/2006 : 09:15:55
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| Looking good bro, those handles are gonna be a challenge-lol |
The Touge: Where drivers are found, not wanted...
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mdwelsh
Junior Member
USA
89 Posts |
Posted - 04/26/2007 : 01:34:56
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Hi Overkill!
If you have not already purchased the O-Bar I have some information thay you may wish to consider.
6061 T6 Box Aluminum would be a better choice as it is hardened and considerably lighter and far superior in strength. I do not think that the creator of the O-Bar would pay to have his product heat-treated and even though I do not know I would imagine he is using 1018 or 1020 bottom of the line cheap steel tubing with cheap sleeves welded in the center of the bar to mount to the trailing arm. There is an old cliche which states, "NEVER drill the frame or any cross members, etcetera." Without additional gusseting around the sleeves that penetrate the trailing arm there is a distinct possibility of potential cracks in the trailing arm.
There is even a 7000 series of T6 and I have heard of an upcoming 8000 series. Even the 6000 series would be superior in strength and rigidity and probably cost about the same.
I will more than likely recieve some criticism for this reply but having spent two decades as a Class A Machinist, jig and fixture builder and tool and die maker I was awake most of the time!
Bear in mind that the trailing arm was designed to flex somewhat by engineering and let us face it; for $100 how good could the 0-Bar be and I frequently notice new ones for sale in classifieds on Forums after purchase. If I am incorrect I will certainly apologize!
Even a slow fabricator could build an O-bar in about twenty minutes from start to finish! Let us be realistic; a piece of tubing, four drilled holes and four welds,both for the sleeves? Not a bad profit margin!
Finally, where does the bar mount; right near the pivot point so realistically how much stiffer could it possibly be?????
Think about it; next to the OEM rubber bushings whereas the trailing arm has yet to fail to the best of my knowledge.
Now if one were to mount a bar closer to the rear suspension then obviously you would definitely stiffen up the suspension.
It has been done!
Sincerely
Mark
quote:
Originally posted by overkill
I'm going to be doing some suspension/exhaust work here early next week so i'll take some picks then and post them up.
And don't buy anything for your fox from Shine, I allmost got screwed by them. They won't return my e-mails or calls and I'm going to end up going with an o-bar rear sway instead (returned my email within 2 hours about pricing and availabity). So I will post up pics of that install too.
I took a que from you and acctually created the custom intake i've been wanting to do for the past 5 years.
I'm going to mount the metal piece in the front air dam.
And here is the exhaust in 2 pieces right now.
The flowmaster muffler is acctually from my BMW, still in great condition and should work just fine.
EDIT: and this experiment http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/VW-Jetta-Rabbit-Fox-CHROME-Audi-Style-4-Drs-Handles-NEW_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQcategoryZ33642QQihZ018QQitemZ280007854689QQrdZ1
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tougefox
Administrator
USA
834 Posts |
Posted - 04/30/2007 : 18:28:10
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| did this ever get installed? |
The Touge: Where drivers are found, not wanted...
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overkill
Moderator
USA
35 Posts |
Posted - 05/01/2007 : 00:36:51
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quote:
Originally posted by tougefox
did this ever get installed?
Yes it has
quote:
Originally posted by mdwelsh
6061 T6 Box Aluminum would be a better choice as it is hardened and considerably lighter and far superior in strength. I do not think that the creator of the O-Bar would pay to have his product heat-treated and even though I do not know I would imagine he is using 1018 or 1020 bottom of the line cheap steel tubing with cheap sleeves welded in the center of the bar to mount to the trailing arm. There is an old cliche which states, "NEVER drill the frame or any cross members, etcetera." Without additional gusseting around the sleeves that penetrate the trailing arm there is a distinct possibility of potential cracks in the trailing arm.
There is even a 7000 series of T6 and I have heard of an upcoming 8000 series. Even the 6000 series would be superior in strength and rigidity and probably cost about the same.
I will more than likely recieve some criticism for this reply but having spent two decades as a Class A Machinist, jig and fixture builder and tool and die maker I was awake most of the time!
Bear in mind that the trailing arm was designed to flex somewhat by engineering and let us face it; for $100 how good could the 0-Bar be and I frequently notice new ones for sale in classifieds on Forums after purchase. If I am incorrect I will certainly apologize!
Thanks for your concern.
Right now, I am a Mechanical Engineering student so I know the dangers of drilling holes. And being a student I can't afford even the most basic machining equipment necessary to fabricate something like this. Although I do have access to the necessary equipment, it is for school use only.
Also, aluminum doesn't have a fatigue life so if it is put under excessive compressive, tensile, and torsional stress and unloaded constantly will cause it to fail. Putting an aluminum bar in the rear beam would most likely cause the aluminum to form a crack and to fail due to the shifting stress it is put under. I know Aluminum is more rigid it just wont hold up long being next to the flexing rear steel beam.
Still the best and cheapest method would be to enclose the rear beam completely with a decent hunk of steel.
And yes, I already have bought the O-bar and installed it and It works well.
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snowfox
Administrator
USA
614 Posts |
Posted - 05/01/2007 : 12:23:34
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| Another point that is overlooked with using 6061 (or any aluminum alloy), is that the OBar is a torsional spring. Even if you were to quickly fab up a duplicate of their product with readily available hardware store materials, when you are finished, you will have to send it out for spring tempering. (Unless of course you have the required furnace and controller to perform the spring tempering yourself...) If you don't, you will likely end up generating plastic deformation after hard turns that will cause the bar to force the rear beam into a 'leaned' attitude that won't be corrected until you turn hard the other way to un-bend it. In the process generating a plastic deformation in the other direction with the opposite beam lean that won't be corrected until you make another hard turn in the original direction, ad nauseum... |
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tougefox
Administrator
USA
834 Posts |
Posted - 05/01/2007 : 13:40:11
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| yo snow does that hold true for strut bars too? |
The Touge: Where drivers are found, not wanted...
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snowfox
Administrator
USA
614 Posts |
Posted - 05/01/2007 : 14:45:36
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quote:
Originally posted by tougefox
yo snow does that hold true for strut bars too?
No. A strut bar is a chasis brace. It's intention is to be rigid and increase the structural rigidity (especially with respect to the torsional rigidity) of the car's chassis. It is NOT meant to function like a spring as the O-Bar and other anti-sway bars do. Strut and other suspension braces need to be light as possible while retaining sufficient strength to prevent any deflection of their geometry. (Technically, there will be *some* deflection, but the less the better. Permanent deformation of a brace = failure of the component.)
As a clarification to my previous post: plastic deformation = permanent deformation. i.e., a metal component has been deflected (bent) far enough that it doesn't come back to its original shape. |
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tougefox
Administrator
USA
834 Posts |
Posted - 05/01/2007 : 18:27:02
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| great cuz i was thinking bout hooking up with this welder and providing fox owners with strut braces. |
The Touge: Where drivers are found, not wanted...
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overkill
Moderator
USA
35 Posts |
Posted - 05/01/2007 : 19:11:42
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quote:
Originally posted by snowfox
Another point that is overlooked with using 6061 (or any aluminum alloy), is that the OBar is a torsional spring.
Good point. Last time I checked, aluminum doesn't make the best springs |
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ATTN:overkill
